Mark-Anthony Turnage joined CCM for a lively chat on October 20. Below is a transcript of the chat.
Jim Fahey (Chicago Symphony Orchestra): Hi, this is Jim Fahey, moderator of today's chat. Mark is here and just settling down to the keyboard.
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Hi.
Jim Fahey: Hi, Mark. Welcome to Chicago. How's your visit to Chicago been so far?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Amazing. I've spent too much money.
Matt Greenberg: Hi Mark-have you spent much time in Chicago before?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I think this is the sixth time I've been, so yes, I have. Almost as much as I've been to New York.
Jim Fahey: We have a really exciting program for Monday's MusicNOW concert, can you tell us about it?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: The MusicNOW program has a very old piece of mine, Kai, which is for cello and large ensemble. It's very jazzy. There's a short piece by Hans Werner Henze for high voice and eight players. It's very intense and beautiful. There's also a piece by my compatriot Jonathan Harvey.
Jim Fahey: Can you tell us a little more about Kai?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I originally wrote an opera based on the life of Charles Mingus which had, possibly, one of the worst librettos ever written. I abandoned it because it didn't work, and I extracted about 20 minutes, and that's why Kai has Mingus references. The cello part is very lyrical. It soars above a very jazzy ensemble which includes 2 saxes, bass guitar and a drum set.
Jim Fahey: Katinka Kleijn is the soloist in Kai. How much interaction have you had with her?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I haven't had so much interaction with Katinka, but I didn't need much, because she plays it so incredibly well. She got the spirit and the mood of the piece immediately. In fact, I only had to ask her to slow down one thing, which is a Charlie Parker quote.
Julia Starzyk (Chicago Symphony Orchestra): I had the opportunity to hear your composition From All Sides on Tuesday evening, and I was really blown away. Have you ever composed a piece for dance before?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I haven't composed a piece for dance before-this is the very first one. I'm 46, so it's sort of unusual for a composer whose written two and a half operas-so I've written quite a bit for theatre but not for dance. So it's sort of strange to have been given this opportunity by the CSO. There have been a couple of possible collaborations, but the music wasn't liked very much, whereas Jorma Elo is very musical, so I'm very excited. 
James Fahey: From All Sides will be performed with Hubbard Street and the CSO in January. What was it like to work with Jorma Elo?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: It's really separate in some ways. When I spoke with Jorma, he gave me timings in sections. He'd say two minutes fast, four minutes romantic, five-minute finale, etc., and that was my brief. He started choreographing it in early December. He does his own thing, really. I can't dance, so I don't know much about it. It's going to be a complete surprise for me
Jim Fahey: When you start to write and face the blank page, how do you start?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: To start off with, I feel depressed, and it takes quite a while to lift yourself of this worry. Sometimes I improvise and I store ideas. Sometimes I have ideas- sketches-stored up for a while, things I can use in the future. I think, “Well, maybe that will fit into a piece in the future.” I probably write the first couple of minutes without really knowing the piece, and then I start imposing some structure. I find when I get to the halfway point it's much easier, and you don't want it to end, so it's really the first week that's hard. If it's a good feeling, it tends to flow.
Jim Fahey: You've mentioned to me that you really enjoy the arranging process. Can you elaborate on that?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: The great thing about arranging is you don't have to come up with the tunes, and you can really relax and have fun. Sometimes when I worked on Scorched, I did it as relaxation while I was writing an opera. The early process I described about working on a new composition-the angst of it isn't there.
What I try to do is get to the essence of the tune, and I often completely change the mood of the piece, like Bill Evans did. So, I quite often will make a slow tune fast and vice versa. Also I feel that there are some fabulous arrangers in the world, many of them American. When I am asked to arrange, I'm asked almost to give a European slant on it. I think they're asking for something that's a bit more hybrid, because I come from contemporary classical music, so called.
Matt Greenberg: What's involved with being a "composer-in -residence"? Is there a typical day-in-the-life?
Marc Van Bree (Chicago Symphony Orchestra): How much different is being a composer-in-residence from being a "non-resident" composer? And, as a follow-up, why did you decide on Chicago?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: There's not really a typical day. There are very intense periods I'm going to spend in Chicago, which involve meeting everyone in the orchestra, the staff, teaching at universities, working with school kids.
But the actual composition is done, obviously, mostly in the UK where I live. But of course, all my main pieces in the next two years are for Chicago, and so I'm constantly thinking for Chicago, even though I'm not always present, and there are lots of e-mails, correspondence, with people like Cliff Colnot for MusicNOW. So it becomes a very intense relationship, which I like, because I like to belong.
I know a lot about the history of the Chicago Symphony, being an avid record collector-not CDs. I had many recordings from Fritz Reiner to Georg Solti, and a lot of my education about orchestral music comes from listening to the Chicago Symphony Orchestra, so it was really nice when I came here the first time in 1994 to realize it was a really nice city as well. Not all great orchestras have great cities.
Jim Fahey: You've worked with our new Principal Conductor Bernard Haitink as well, correct?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Yes, absolutely. I wrote a piece called Some Days for mezzo soprano and small chamber orchestra which Haitink did in London in 1990, I think it was. He took it around to the States and then recorded it with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra on Decca in 1994. I feel very honored, actually, that he did my piece, because he doesn't do so much new music, although he is fantastic at it, and we just got on very well. What I noticed is that he has huge respect for players, and there was none of the conductor-“maestro”-attitude, just a genuine love for the players, and that filters through to composers.
robapple: You've mentioned Evans, Mingus, and Parker. Do you have particular favorite jazz players and have any influenced your composing? 
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I suppose the most influential jazz player on my writing is Miles Davis. I'm a Miles Davis geek. I love pretty much everything that he ever was involved in. I'm very lucky to have collaborated with a few of his ex-sidemen, like John Scofield and Dave Holland.
I regard jazz as a major art form and I take it very seriously, and I think these players are as important as any other music over the last 100 years. They mean a lot to me. Being a big fan, especially in my teens, I never thought I would actually collaborate with these guys, so I'm still pinching myself.
I pretty much like all periods of jazz, from Bix Beiderbecke to Brad Mehldau. To be honest, I prefer small group jazz, apart from Gil Evans and some of the bigger Mingus big bands.
piano88: Just curious what was a highlight for you at the Risor Kammermusikkfest in Norway this summer?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: The whole festival in Norway was a highlight. The best music festival I've ever been involved in. It's a stunning location and great audience. It was a real privilege to work with Leif Ove Andsnes.
Lori M (Chicago Symphony Orchestra): Would you share a bit about how you came to feature the sound of the cello in our work, Kai?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: In Kai, the cello is my favorite string instrument, and the string instrument I felt closest to, although I haven't played it. I am a big fan of the cello repertoire and funny enough, I've just married a cellist. It's probably the melancholic side of the cello that initially attracted me. This affected me from when I was a youngster listening to Bach cello suites and I now regret that I never learned the instrument.
Steve Burkholder (Chicago Classical Music): What was your axe growing up? Also, do you compose on the piano?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: My axe was the piano. I had delusions of being a concert pianist, but I quickly realized there were many people better than me. I also played the flute very badly, and the alto saxophone even worse than that. I do write at the piano for about 75% of the time.
Jim Fahey: Speaking of young musicians. I know that working with young musicians is an important part of your residency here. Can you discuss your work with the Merit Music Program?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I went into Merit last time I was here in May. I was deeply impressed with the program they have there. I'm very excited about working with the students. They are coming to a rehearsal of Kai and then next week I'm going in to work with the composers. We haven't done anything yet.
Bohumil: I loved your “meteorite” for the new Planets CD. How did Sir Rattle approach you to do the project?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I've worked with Sir Simon since 1990, when I was composer in residence with the city of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra in the UK, so we've collaborated many times. At the beginning of his tenure as the principal conductor, he programmed a piece of mine with the Berlin Philharmonic called Blood on the Floor, and he asked me at the beginning of the first rehearsal whether I wanted to write an Asteroid for the orchestra. I didn't really expect to get a Berlin Phil commission and certainly not at the beginning of a rehearsal. He also told me the other composers involved and it was a nice mixture.
Jim Fahey: Can you tell a little more about the Planets project?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: It's called Ceres, which was one of the first asteroids to be discovered. I was inspired by the Bill Bryson book, A Brief History of Almost Everything, where he talks about an asteroid hitting the earth. So my piece is about this possibility and the devastation thereafter. So a very happy piece!
Jim Fahey: Who are some of the other composers on the project?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: The other composers involved were Kaaja Saariaho, Matthias Pintshcer, and Brett Dean.
Jim Fahey: Who were your teachers or your influences when you started to compose?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: My teacher from the age of 15 was Oliver Knussen, who is an amazing teacher and influence on me. Then I studied at Tanglewood in the U.S. with Gunther Schuller and Hans Werner Henze. Henze has been a particular influence on me for my career and also my attitude towards work.
Jim Fahey: Have you had much interaction with Osvaldo Golijov?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I met him here in May for the first time, which is surprising because we have many mutual friends and should have probably met years ago. We've had a bit of interaction but we want to do more, in fact we want to share a MusicNOW concert in the next season. Although we're very different composers, there are certain fundamental things we share.
Jim Fahey: After this residency, when will you be back in Chicago?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I'll be back in January for the premiere of From All Sides and the MusicNOW concert.
Jim Fahey: Where does the title, From All Sides come from?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: It's not a quote, but it sounds like it, or a title of a book or anything. It's called that because the players surround the audience at certain points, so the sound is hitting you from all sides.
Jim Fahey: Are there any questions from others in the chatbox?
Matt Greenberg: I'm curious if you've written many choral works, or do you think you will, in addition to your operas and orchestral pieces?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I've not written many choral works. I recently wrote a piece for the Berlin Radio Choir and the Berlin Phil called A Relic of Memory. I also wrote a piece for the CBSO in the early 90s called Leaving, which is now withdrawn. I find it very hard to write for chorus. It doesn't come naturally to me. One thing I have done very recently is write a series of carols, one of which is for the famous Nine Lessons in King's College Cambridge. It'll be performed there on Christmas Eve this year. So I do get asked quite a lot, but it takes me a long time to write the pieces.
Marc Van Bree: Your sound is obviously very different from Osvaldo Golijov's, but through the MusicNOW collaboration, is there any chance of mutual influence on each other's work?
Sean Hopp (Chicago Symphony Orchestra): I've heard that "3 screaming popes" was partially inspired by the Bacon painting. If so, was this a conscious effort to translate the piece into music, or just raw inspiration? 
Mark-Anthony Turnage: It's just raw inspiration. There are four outbursts toward the end of the piece, but they aren't really screams, as such. I used Spanish dances, which are partially hidden, because the pope paintings by Bacon are based on paintings by Velázquez. So it was a lot of levels of inspiration that inspired the piece.
piano88: Have you had occasion to meet or familiarize yourself with the new works of Todd Machover of MIT, with hyperscore?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Regarding Todd Machover, I know his work from IRCAM in Paris. Because of the electro-acoustic element, those composers tend to be separated from composers like me. It's a different world.
Bohumil: I may be asking you to generalize a bit, but do you find that the players in the major orchestras like performing new works by contemporary composers?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: I think it's very varied-how the players feel. Obviously some composers write against instruments, which probably doesn't go down well with orchestras. But I think, even though they might not like the pieces necessarily, if you have an ability to orchestrate, there's usually some respect. I find it really helpful if you have a few friends dotted around the orchestra. Sometimes they can influence some of the players around them who are being negative.
Steve Burkholder: You mentioned that you use the piano 75% of the time to compose. What is the other 25%? Any computer/MIDI use?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: The 25% away from the piano is mainly at a desk, but I do use Sibelius to make the fair copy.
Lori M: When composing, do you ever imagine a space (an ideal space?) in which your work might be performed?
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Well, there are certain concert halls that are wonderful. But these days I really like concerts especially for chamber music in art galleries, because I like the space. At the moment, that's almost my favorite venue, but for orchestra, something that isn't too reverberant-because I write a lot of notes.
Jim Fahey: Well, on that note, thanks to all for joining us today. Mark, we're very excited about your residency with the CSO and look forward to hearing your works.
Mark-Anthony Turnage: Thanks. Great pleasure to be in Chicago, and the weather's got better.
piano88: Keep up the good work(s)! Thanks for your creativity.
Marc Van Bree: Cheers, Mark! And go Gunners!
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